F550 truck build...maybe??

[haulin rv]

I may have the chance to pick up a F550 CHEAP! It has a bad engine and trans. My thought was to take my time and build it the way I thought it should be. I was thinking 12v Cummins and a NV5600 6 speed. And then of course a sleeper. What ya all think? I figure I'd only have $6k or so in it when its done.

[Slim]

From my past experiences, conservative cost projections usually double or more in the end, but I like the idea. I prefer the Allison auto (such as the AT545) behind a 12v mechanical motor as they are plentiful, cheap and about bulletproof.

[haulin rv]

But with the lack of a lock up converter and a 1:1 ratio the 545 won't work. It would really spinning some rpm's to do 55.

As far as cost the truck is almost free, I can get the 12v for $1500 complete (w/ nv4500 5 speed). Figure truck and drive train I'll have $3500 or so. Its a long wheel base so no stretch for the sleeper.

[Slim]

I agree, It wouldn't work well without a final gear change in the rear. Your plan looks well thought out so how could you go wrong.

[haulin rv]

Now I'm cursed:D

But anyway I'm thinking with the project not having a deadline I can scrounge parts as needed and just take my time. Plus if I need to bail out I don't think I could get hurt with the amount I'll have invested.

[Slim]

With an open time frame and your diligence, it should be a success. I just hate all the transmission/clutch issues that i've seen in these setups. There has to be a better way!

[haulin rv]

Me too. Once I actually own the truck I am going to call in some help from a friend who has worked in the truck parts industry and see what other options he can come up with. The 5.9 has been used in so many applications there has to be something better. Whatever it may be has to be cost effective too.

[Slim]

Ford used the 5.9 in their heavier series of trucks 600, 700, 800 series. They used Allisons for autos, but I don't recall what they used for manuals. May be a good place to start looking as there are many in the bone yard by now. As I recall, Jarrett has that combo in his f800 with an Allison.

[ccoop769]

Last I recall the conversion to add a allison is expensive. I like the idea, I always like ford trucks with cummins. I assume your building a work truck or a DD???? Can always go all out and drop in a 6.7 cummins with a allison 3000 series. If that big ole tranny would even fit..

[haulin rv]

Work truck and I want to do the 12 valve to eliminate all the electronic hassles. Think Spicer did a 7 speed behind the 5.9 in the F650/750.

[pmmjarrett]

Ford used the 5.9 in their heavier series of trucks 600, 700, 800 series. They used Allisons for autos, but I don't recall what they used for manuals. May be a good place to start looking as there are many in the bone yard by now. As I recall, Jarrett has that combo in his f800 with an Allison.

You mean "HAD" that combo in my ex F800. 5.9 12V P7100 pumped w/ Allison At545

The 5.9 was back by almost anything from Ford Chevy and Dodge trannies with their respective belhousing adaptors to anything that will fit on a SAE3 or SAE2 bellhousing Adaptor from the lowly Allison 545 to a 13 speed Fuller.

Now if you want an Automatic you can run the MT643 behind it on an SAE2 adaptor, much better tranny than the AT545. For the manual run a fuller trans 5, 6, 9, 10 or 13 speed on an SAE2 adaptor. Most small trannies on these smaller adaptors are direct drive so changing the rear gears is a must.

Come to think of it I have almost everything he needs for that conversion in my shop. 5.9 12 valve cummins that needs a head injectors and pump, Fuller 5 speed complete with everything to bolt up to the 5.9 and a Roadmaster 52" sleeper.:D

No I havn't forgot about the pics of the sleeper for ya yet.

[Slim]

Somehow I knew you would jump all over that with the answers, in fact, I was counting on you to tune in. Great info and Thanks! I really like those 5 and 6 speed Eaton/fullers. Other than some shift cover issues that have been corrected, they are pretty much trouble free and hold up very well. They can really take a beating, but are simple to work on when needed.

[pmmjarrett]

Me, I wanna see him drop in a P pumped 12 valve with a #0 torque plate in a worked over injection pump with some 370 marine injectors and a set of twin turbos to darken the skys then back it with a Fuller roadranger RTOOF 9513....... She's good for 1100 ft lbs torque.

10th is 1:1
11th is .84
12th is .73
13th is .62:D

[Slim]

Fuel is too high dollar to be spewing it raw out the pipes and the soot would get all over the cars. That F550 wouldn't be good with a doghouse for that trans either much less a 12000 pound front end to support the weight...LOL

[ColoradoRVHauler]

Yep put a 7 speed in it. Forget the allison. Unless it has an overdrive forget it. Jarrett didnt like his allison either, too many rpms. Hell just go for broke Haulin, put a eaton 10 speed in it, lol. There are tons of spicer 7 speeds available. They used em behind c7 cats and that lil 3000 series cats and the 5.9 and 8.3 cummins. Hell speakin of, an 8.3 cummins and 7 speed would be a fun combo. 800+ torque. lol

You got the right idea... Now get er done Jarrett JR. lol

Carey

[ColoradoRVHauler]

Itd prolly get 10+ with Jarretts combo, and wouldnt weigh much over stock. You gotta remember a 13speed is a 9 speed with a box bolted on it. The 9 speed is what many freight hailers use cause they are light weight. Jarretts combo would be a wiiner! Might even get 12towing.

Carey

[Slim]

Eaton/fuller offers two 6 speed trans with .78 overdrive in top gear. FSO-6406-A @ 660 ft lbs torque and the FSO-8406-A @ 860 ft lbs. These should allow the use of your current rear gear. Comparable Spicers are grenades without the pin.

[pmmjarrett]

Eaton/fuller offers two 6 speed trans with .78 overdrive in top gear. FSO-6406-A @ 660 ft lbs torque and the FSO-8406-A @ 860 ft lbs. These should allow the use of your current rear gear. Comparable Spicers are grenades without the pin.

Those FSO six speeds are hard to find. IIRC Navistar had a version of these made for them by Eaton with a propriatary input shaft that can be swapped out to turn it back into an FSO, forget what the model numbers started with.

Be cheaper and easier to change rear ratio, Lot easier and cheaper to find another tranny to swap in too if the need ever arose. Agree on the spicer trans, rockwell trannies not much better. Eaton Fuller only way to go if you gotta row the gearbox.

[Slim]

Those FSO six speeds are hard to find. IIRC Navistar had a version of these made for them by Eaton with a propriatary input shaft that can be swapped out to turn it back into an FSO, forget what the model numbers started with.

Be cheaper and easier to change rear ratio, Lot easier and cheaper to find another tranny to swap in too if the need ever arose. Agree on the spicer trans, rockwell trannies not much better. Eaton Fuller only way to go if you gotta row the gearbox.

If using a direct trans with a higher rear gear, I would find a trans with the lower 1st gear to get rolling. That would be the "A" designation at the end of the model number on an eaton/fuller trans.

[pmmjarrett]

If using a direct trans with a higher rear gear, I would find a trans with the lower 1st gear to get rolling. That would be the "A" designation at the end of the model number on an eaton/fuller trans.

No B or C ratios in 6 speed direct trannies N ratio 6 speed OK too.

My buddies FL50 low pro with 225/70R-19.5 tires (same size as on an F550) had an FS4205A with 3.31 rear

My F800 with 245/70R-19.5 rubber had 3.58 Gears.

I think I could have pushed my Cummins down to about a 3.08 gear, that thing would flat out spank my buddies 3126 CAT in the hills and head winds and both engines were rated at 190 hp running about the same RPMs. Spanked him even worse when I dropped in the #6 fuel plate, mild performance injectors and upped the boost a bit by adjusting the wastegate and it didn't affect my fuel economy.

[Slim]

No B or C ratios in 6 speed direct trannies N ratio 6 speed OK too.

My buddies FL50 low pro with 225/70R-19.5 tires (same size as on an F550) had an FS4205A with 3.31 rear

My F800 with 245/70R-19.5 rubber had 3.58 Gears.

I think I could have pushed my Cummins down to about a 3.08 gear, that thing would flat out spank my buddies 3126 CAT in the hills and head winds and both engines were rated at 190 hp running about the same RPMs. Spanked him even worse when I dropped in the #6 fuel plate, mild performance injectors and upped the boost a bit by adjusting the wastegate and it didn't affect my fuel economy.

I looked at a chart that only showed A's and B's with the A's having 9 to 1 low gear and B's having 8 to 1 low. Wouldn't want to see all the shake and rattle before the roll from too high of a low gear, and those button clutches squeal like a pig when you wind them up and pinch them. I might poke around and find some C and N specs for comparison. You got me curious.

[pmmjarrett]

I looked at a chart that only showed A's and B's with the A's having 9 to 1 low gear and B's having 8 to 1 low. Wouldn't want to see all the shake and rattle before the roll from too high of a low gear, and those button clutches squeal like a pig when you wind them up and pinch them. I might poke around and find some C and N specs for comparison. You got me curious.

I stand corrected, my charts outdated. Cripes there are A, B, N, AA, AL, ALL, GL, DL, DLL, S, ASX, ASW and some with nothing.

Here's the link to current ratio chart (http://www.roadranger.com/ecm/groups/public/@pub/@eaton/@roadranger/documents/content/ct_207778.xls)

[haulin rv]

Well they decided to hang on to it for now. They have a couple others so its going into lets say "parts" status. In the spring they are suppose to get some new trucks, so we will see what happens.

Maybe I'll just buy a runner and use it and start collecting parts. Also have found myself looking at E450's, they look pretty cool with a 63" Pete sleeper behind them.

[Slim]

The E series cutaways are nice for the open connection to the sleeper area, but are famous for suddenly developing leaks at the seam from body twist. I have found them to be uncomfortable to say the least when running long trips, majorly suck to work on and you are limited on transmission options. They also retain much more heat in the engine compartment due to the way the engine is stuffed into the cave. The heat then migrates into the cab through the doghouse cover and cooks your right leg. Nuff said.